Amber Listserv / Amberguous

[Andy Ng]

Kirks, I don't merely "think" that fossilization could be halted in the
interior of an amber piece. And neither is it a proposal. I've seen it first
hand. Mind you, I'm not saying it occurs in all pieces...just in a few
pieces, and they are in the minority. The very fact that such pieces do
exist in Borneo could mean that similar ones exist elsewhere in the world.
They aren't detected for the simple reason that people can't bear to chop up
a nice big chunk of showpiece amber.

The first time I encountered such a piece was about 2 years back when
packing a 100kg order. I'd never have noticed it too, had not that piece
break. Makes me wish I'd kept it instead of chucking it in the garbage.
There have been at least 2 or 3 more similar pieces since then. One of them
was discovered by a client.

As you may well know, I wholesale Borneo resinite, and revealing such a
thing is not doing myself any favors. I have all the incentive to just keep
quiet and let things slide but choose not to, because I believe in full
disclosure. This recent bout of copal/amber discussions jiggled my memory
and as usual, I typed what was on my mind.

If you believe in the law of averages, I constantly maintain my downtown
stocks at around the 2 metric ton level, and have 3.5 to 4MT in storage.
That means I've seen a lot of resinites pass through my hands. It also means
I've seen more unusual stuff. The things I usually post on the listserv are
chosen to be close to what is normally 'mainstream' for a good reason: I do
not wish to post certain percularities that are not vital or relavent to the
situation at hand, thus avoiding any unnecessary upheavals.

Andy

On 7/13/06, kirk stephan <kirkstephan at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> *Andy, Do you really think the fossilization process would be halted in
> the intereior of an amber piece? I would think the aging/chemical process
> would affect the entire piece...right through to the interior. But it's sure
> an interesting proposal. Thanks for your comments on my site, kirk*
>
> *'Invite to my site,of course< http://geocities.com/kirkstephany/tools.htm
> *
>
>
> ------------------------------
> From: *"Andy Ng" <andy.ng.aik.hoe at gmail.com>*
> To: *"kirk stephan" <kirkstephan at hotmail.com>*
> CC: *amber at ambericawest.com*
> Subject: *Re: Amber Listserv / Amberguous*
> Date: *Wed, 12 Jul 2006 11:17:35 +0800*
>
>
> Kirk,
>
> It may be 'borderline' amber, but then again would not the 2 or 3 inch
> layer of amberized resin have effectively prevented the inside of the piece
> from turning into amber? I seriously doubt that the volatile elements of
> resin have much of a chance of escaping thru the amberized layer, unless
> there are cracks or the piece is broken up by natural forces.
>
> How many people would be willing to hacksaw thru a nice hefty polished
> chunk of 'amber' just to see if its innermost parts are also amberized? My
> point is simple: just because the external portion of a piece passes the hot
> needle/acetone/salt water tests, it doesn't mean that the entire piece is
> amber. Copal may lurk in its depths.
>
> I think I can already hear the gnashing of teeth as amber dealers
> worldwide are collectively wishing this loudmouth from Borneo would shut up.
> Did he really have to go open a new can of worms? :-P It's not my purpose to
> cast dark doubts over this industry (which I'm a part of). Rather, it's an
> attempt to simplify and clarify matters. With concerns of the end-consumer
> in mind, I say this:
>
> We live in an age where the ingenuity of man allows copal to be turned
> into amber on a mass-production basis, and fake inclusions/tree-resin
> substitutes abound in the market. If the consumer wishes to possess genuine
> and untreated fossilized tree resin, buy it in rough form with the crust
> still on. If one buys it in any other form, well...ya pays yer money and ya
> takes yer chances.
>
> BTW, nifty website you have there Kirk!
>
> Andy
>
>
>
> On 7/12/06, kirk stephan <kirkstephan at hotmail.com > wrote:
> >
> >  *Andy, Doesn't that sound as if the material was on the 'borderline'
> > time period for metamorphing from Copal to amber? kirk *
> >
> >
> > *'Invite to my site,of course<
> > http://geocities.com/kirkstephany/tools.htm *
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> > From: *"Andy Ng" <andy.ng.aik.hoe at gmail.com >*
> > To: *amber <amber at ambericawest.com>*
> > Subject: *Amber Listserv / Amberguous *
> > Date: *Tue, 11 Jul 2006 23:01:28 +0800*
> >
> > "Ahh I see, said the blind man to the ice-cream seller."
> >
> > I guess it was only you posting, Glen. Thanks so much for your response.
> > I had been meaning to reply to your post on the copal vs amber debate, but
> > wanted to make sure the listserv was chugging along properly first.
> >
> > What would you make of this scenario: a piece of amber (about 9 inches
> > to a foot thick) tests positive as amber by its resistance to acetone doused
> > on it. BUT when sawn open and has the exposed innards splashed with acetone,
> > is marred like a copal? Amber on the outside, copal on the inside.
> >
> > Andy
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Amber mailing list
> > Amber at amber@ ambericawest.com
> > http://ambericawest.com/mailman/listinfo/amber_ambericawest.com
> >
> >
>
>
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